Susan Lewis: Leading with Your Heart
Episode Description:
Susan Lewis is Head of Drama Development at ABC Signature.
TRANSCRIPT:
Fanshen Cox (00:11):
Welcome back to Sister Brunch with me, Fanshen Cox.
Anya Adams (00:14):
And me, Anya Adams. We're continuing to talk to black women, plus driving and thriving in the entertainment industry. We are so freaking excited for incredibly accomplished and inspiring guest today, Susan Lewis. Susan is the SVP and head of drama development for ABC Signature, which is a part of Disney Television Studios. She was formerly the SVP of original programming at Starz where she oversaw series including BBC's co-production, "The Dublin Murders," Rebecca Cutter and Jerry Bruckheimer's "High Town," and the acclaimed playwright Katori Hall's "P-VALLEY."
And prior to that, she was a producer for Alicia Keys' production company, AK Worldwide. She worked on projects including Viceland's "Hustle" and feature films like "The Inevitable," "The Feat of Mister and Pete," and "Pariah." And she was the VP of development at MTV Films where she acquired the manuscript for Stephanie Meyers' young adult novel "Twilight," and oversaw the initial development of that franchise.
Fanshen Cox (01:19):
And wait till you hear this woman's trajectory into Hollywood, too, because it's amazing. We are so, so excited to have you on Sister Brunch. Speaking of your trajectory, tell us what has been your path to get to this amazing position you're in today?
Susan Lewis (01:37):
I started, like most kids do, thinking that movies were documentaries. I didn't realize that it was ... "E.T." wasn't a documentary about an alien that crash-landed, and really, genuinely loved movies as a kid. And loved pop culture, and was reading Teen Beat, Tiger Beat, all these magazines as a kid. And Rolling Stone. Was a obsessive music fan, an obsessive movie fan. And the only thing I ever wanted to do was history, learn stories about people and do English and maybe some English classes. I wasn't really interested in anything else, which was reflected in my report cards.
I went to college, I became a history major because, again, stories, and I also, while I was there, took one class where we studied the Vietnam war through pop culture. At least, that's what I remember doing because I somehow was able to write a paper about the portrayal through movies like "Apocalypse Now" and "Platoon", which I think I watched and I loved because there were a lot of cute guys in it.
Anyway, I wrote that paper and it was really entertaining, but I was also like, "These movies are very informative, too. I'm learning something from them, and they all have a different perspective." When I graduated, I knew I only wanted to work in entertainment, and it was either going to be in movies or music, and I didn't know anything besides being a director or an actor. But the only director I think I knew was Steven Spielberg and, I guess by then, Oliver Stone and Spike Lee, because Spike Lee's "Do the Right Thing" came out. And I knew acting.
And then I graduated, moved back home to New York, ended up getting a job at a clothing store, as one does with a college degree. I had gone to Wisconsin. One of the women who worked in the sales with me was from Madison. Somebody said, "You got to meet Wendy." I went, I met Wendy. Turned out Wendy was working as an intern at the same time for a producer called Scott [crosstalk 00:03:43].
Fanshen Cox (03:43):
[crosstalk 00:03:43].
Anya Adams (03:43):
[crosstalk 00:03:43].
Susan Lewis (03:42):
I didn't even know who that was. All I knew was, when she told me what she did as an intern, she explained writing coverage, and that meant reading scripts. And I thought, "I love reading. This is my way in! I can read the scripts." And she explained to me what development was, and what being a producer was, and that was really the ticket. Now I understood what I could do, because pop culture was important. Knowing actors was important.
Wendy and her roommate at the time became very close friends of mine. This was all in New York. Wendy was then transferred to Los Angeles to work for Scott. She became an assistant; she moved to L.A. I was still working at Fringe Connection and my parents were like, "We didn't pay for you to go to college to do this. What are you going to do with your life?" So I took the LSAT, I applied to law school, I got accepted. I was going to go, not really, but it was a good story to tell my parents. And it, at the time, made sense. So I applied to, got accepted into, and received a substantial scholarship to Howard.
Now I'm like, "That was a big deal. I was going to go to Howard Law School, and be a lawyer, and do sociology or social work. I was really going to save the world." What had happened was I went to L.A. to visit Wendy and Hilary, and decided, "Actually, I'll take a year before I go do that. Let me just take a year."
Anya Adams (05:18):
Yeah.
Fanshen Cox (05:19):
Find out who I want to be.
Susan Lewis (05:20):
I told my parents this. They were like, "What is wrong with you." Anyway, I did it. I moved to L.A. Landed on their couch. First day we're there, we get some prank phone calls from some weird guys who were pretending that they went to a Duran Duran concert with Wendy, and because they have enough information and actually sounds real because she had been at a Duran Duran concert with some people ...
Fanshen Cox (05:20):
Oh, no!
Susan Lewis (05:49):
... and finally, back in those days I think you could *69 people, we realized it was a friend of a friend of Wendy's, this guy Vinny. And he and his buddy Chris were just being ... I don't know. They might've been under the influence. We figure out it's them, those guys come over to the house. They meet me.
"Oh, Susan, what are you doing in Los Angeles?" "Well, I just moved here and I want to work in film," and Chris, who's a producer, says, "Well, I'm producing a movie that Vinny is an actor in, and we need more PAs. Why don't you come to office tomorrow and maybe we can get you a job." And that is what happened.
Fanshen Cox (06:33):
This is Sister Brunch with Fanshen Cox and Anya Adams. Stay tuned for more of our conversation with Hollywood development executive Susan Lewis.
Welcome back to Sister Brunch. I'm Fanshen and we are back with Susan Lewis. First of all Susan, we have to say about your ... what's so amazing about your story is that you knew what you wanted to do. From early on, you knew what you loved and you just didn't know what it would look like. But then you were so open to all of the signs. You got a full scholarship to Howard for law, but when someone said, "Will you be a PA on a film?" You were like, "Absolutely." That's huge!
Susan Lewis (07:31):
Unpaid. No money.
Fanshen Cox (07:32):
No! I didn't even realize that part of it.
Susan Lewis (07:35):
They didn't pay me!
Fanshen Cox (07:35):
Wait.
Susan Lewis (07:38):
It was an indie.
Fanshen Cox (07:39):
And what did you do in those early days to support yourself? More retail?
Susan Lewis (07:45):
Ate ramen noodles.
Fanshen Cox (07:47):
Yes.
Susan Lewis (07:47):
I lived on the couch of these ... of Wendy and Hilary. I lived on their futon.
Fanshen Cox (07:52):
Wow.
Susan Lewis (07:53):
And I had saved some money, so I had a little bit of money. And then, I did that job and then I got another PA job for a little bit of money. While we were making the movie, Vinny was ... we were both looking for a place to live. I think Wendy had said to me, "I think Vinny needs a roommate." We had hit it off, we were friendly, and we became roommates. And we lived right up the street from Wendy and Hilary. We had a very, very, very cheap apartment. But it was great. And it was a time when you could live in Los Angeles.
I think our combined rent might've been $650. It was one bathroom. It was like a jack and jill or whatever, so there were two entrances. It was not ... but it was like a little home.
Fanshen Cox (08:43):
At that time, Susan, did you ... as you started to learn what development was and where you might be able to go in the industry, did you have a dream career in your head of "this is still not then."
Susan Lewis (08:57):
This is part of the problem, Fanshen. I've never had that. I just kind of go where I can tell stories.
Fanshen Cox (09:05):
I love it. I love it.
Susan Lewis (09:06):
Looking back, and maybe to my detriment because I can look at my colleagues who were more intentional, and who had the next job in mind when they took the first job.
Fanshen Cox (09:06):
Right, right.
Susan Lewis (09:18):
I didn't do that.
Fanshen Cox (09:18):
Okay.
Susan Lewis (09:19):
And I was thinking about that this morning. Where would I be if I had been a little bit more intentional about my choices. I think I worked with Alicia for a long time. Looking back I'm like, "Maybe I worked for her for too long." And had I left that job earlier, and came into TV, and returned to being an executive, where would I be now? That's no way to live.
Fanshen Cox (09:45):
Yeah. Plus, you made two amazing films there. "Pariah" and "Mister and Pete" are ... "Mister and Pete" is one that a lot of people haven't seen, and you have to see this film. It is beautiful. It really is a beautiful story, and just one of those underrated stories.
Susan Lewis (10:06):
Yeah.
Fanshen Cox (10:06):
So there's that. Some executives work forever and end up with one credit of something that actually got put into the world, you know.
Anya Adams (10:14):
It's fascinating because I feel like, looking at just your career, the idea of an executive being hired for their storytelling instincts and how important it is to have diversity in execs, because those stories, they are instinctual. They are what resonates with you. Do you want to talk a little bit about "Twilight"?
Susan Lewis (10:34):
Sure. We started this podcast talking about how I watched "Platoon" because there were cute men it. Let's focus in on that for a moment. I think I lead with my 13-year-old girl's heart.
Fanshen Cox (10:48):
Yes.
Susan Lewis (10:49):
We had a book scout in New York when I was in L.A. working at MTV at the time. It was MTV. Our whole purpose was to entertain young people. It was when MTV actually was a thing that people watched because it was pre-iPhone, pre-YouTube, pre-smart social media, all of that. So we had all their eyeballs. Which was so fun for me because I didn't want to make "A Beautiful Mind", I wanted to make "Save the Last Dance".
Fanshen Cox (11:19):
I love it.
Susan Lewis (11:21):
That was the muscle I was always working. My colleague in New York, Mark James, a great book scout, had sourced this book. It's a teen love story. It just happens to be the love triangle is a human and a vampire and a werewolf. And he has the information, "This is going to be a big book. A well-known title," all these kinds of things. He sends it to me and I start reading it, and I picture Johnny Depp in my head. He's the brooding Robert Pattinson character, right?
I'm reading it and I'm like, "Who doesn't want to be Bella and have these choices?" Right? And I read it and I called my boss, and I was like, "I read it." And I'm explaining it to this older dude. "It's great, and teen, and love, and vampires, and werewolves." And he's just like, "Okay." But he trusts me. He trusts me, and so concurrently, another executive at the company received the manuscript from somebody else. We were like, "Oh, we're both reading the same thing."
We decide we're going to take it to Paramount, to this film studio, and we take it to Karen Rosenfeld who then becomes a producer on the movie when it is taken out of Paramount. She's the executive who optioned it for us.
Fanshen Cox (11:21):
Wow.
Susan Lewis (12:43):
And I remember her saying, "We don't want to spend a lot on the option."
Fanshen Cox (12:47):
Right.
Susan Lewis (12:47):
Nobody knew what it was going to become.
Anya Adams (12:54):
Also, I feel like it started ... It was like a resurgence of vampire ... This made it sexy.
Susan Lewis (12:59):
Yes, exactly. Exactly. What was really interesting was when we started ... Now we optioned it. Now we have to have somebody come on and adapt it. And every writer responded to it. From the horror writers to women who were more focused on the love triangle and the romantic element.We had multiple writers with great takes, and I remember at that point, that hadn't happened, where it was like, "We could go this way. We could go this way. We could go this way." And we ended up choosing this writer, Mark Lord, who adapted it. By that point, I think I was in L.A. for the beginning, then I ended up moving back to New York and we had the scripts, and by then the book had been published, and was a huge bestseller.
Fanshen Cox (13:49):
Right.
Susan Lewis (13:50):
There was a followup, and that was also a bestseller, and they weren't doing anything with it at Paramount. It was the number one book in the country for how many weeks on end?
Fanshen Cox (14:03):
They were just sitting on it.
Susan Lewis (14:04):
And they were just sitting on it. And then I left to go to Alicia's, and eventually the decision was made at Paramount to put the property into turnaround. So they let it go. The option had come up on, I would imagine, underlying rights on the book, and they decided they weren't going to make it. The male executive running the company didn't ...
Fanshen Cox (14:28):
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Susan Lewis (14:29):
Even though, it's like, "That is math. If I invest this much money in this movie, and all those people go see it, and we have the marketing of MTV and all these things ..." You know?
Fanshen Cox (14:41):
Yeah.
Susan Lewis (14:41):
But I guess they decided it was too big of a risk, and Summit made it.
Anya Adams (14:49):
Hi, it's Anya, and you're listening to Sister Brunch. Stay tuned; we'll be right back.
Fanshen Cox (14:53):
Did you know what this is? Were you asking? Were you in your head like, "What is this?" I'm going to tell you. It's Sister Brunch with Anya Adams and Fanshen Cox. Now back to our interview.
Let's talk about the challenges or benefits of being a woman, being a black woman in your position. And also, I think, if you're comfortable talking about it, you also come from a white mom and a black dad.
Susan Lewis (15:31):
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Fanshen Cox (15:31):
I'm curious if you feel like that has an influence on the things that you're drawn to?
Susan Lewis (15:36):
Challenges, benefits. The challenge of being, I would just say, a woman in this industry sometimes is that people don't listen to you.
Fanshen Cox (15:36):
Yep.
Susan Lewis (15:47):
And the benefit is sometimes people don't listen to you and you can sneak your ideas in.
Fanshen Cox (15:47):
Yeah.
Susan Lewis (15:53):
And make them theirs.
Fanshen Cox (15:54):
Right.
Susan Lewis (15:55):
And then they don't know that they were listening to you, but they were and they took your idea.
Anya Adams (15:59):
When you say "people," do you mean men or do you mean men and women?
Susan Lewis (16:04):
Do I mean men and women? Listen, I wouldn't be where I was if people hadn't listened to me.
Fanshen Cox (16:10):
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Susan Lewis (16:11):
Right? People clearly listened to me in some way, and if I'm really honest, the people who supported me and who gave me jobs were all white men.
Fanshen Cox (16:22):
I've heard that a lot. That's my job.
Susan Lewis (16:26):
Right? Yeah.
Fanshen Cox (16:27):
Yeah.
Susan Lewis (16:28):
Whether it was Chris Moore hiring me as a PA on the first ... on "Cruise" or "Glory Days", to being hired by a white man when I went to work as an assistant at John Peters. A white man taking me to Three Arts, and then being hired by David Gale at MTV Films.
Fanshen Cox (16:47):
Yeah.
Susan Lewis (16:47):
They did. They did hire me.
Fanshen Cox (16:49):
There is the fact that there are a lot more of them in positions of power to be able to hire you.
Susan Lewis (16:54):
Yes.
Fanshen Cox (16:54):
Right?
Susan Lewis (16:55):
Right.
Fanshen Cox (16:55):
There's that.
Susan Lewis (16:57):
I've never had a woman boss until I worked with Alicia.
Fanshen Cox (17:01):
Yeah. Both of those things ... Yeah.
Susan Lewis (17:03):
And then all of the people in her life were men. White men.
Fanshen Cox (17:07):
Yeah, yeah.
Susan Lewis (17:09):
I think being mixed is probably a superpower. You can't tell me not to make "Dublin Murders".
Fanshen Cox (17:17):
Right.
Susan Lewis (17:18):
Right?
Fanshen Cox (17:18):
Right.
Susan Lewis (17:20):
And you also can't say, "Don't make 'Pariah'."
Fanshen Cox (17:22):
Right.
Susan Lewis (17:22):
I can fit into both those worlds somehow, and imagine myself and others into those worlds. Maybe in a way that somebody else wouldn't be able to.
Fanshen Cox (17:33):
Or at least not expecting to be able to, and therefor wouldn't have the opportunity. Yeah.
Susan Lewis (17:39):
Yeah, yeah.
Fanshen Cox (17:39):
Well, and I think about that even as you talk about having the Tiger Beat and the young teenage heart, because for me, a lot of times, I have this thing that shuts me down and doesn't allow me to consume content that I can't see myself in. And so it's like I have this block, and yeah, the creative mind, which I wish I had more of, could have read those books and I could've put Bruce Lee in the brooding character. You know what I mean? But instead, my mind was like, "No, these are written for white people," versus being able to read it and being able to plug in something that could feel more representative. But I admire that you are able to walk that line of both worlds and then also be respected for that.
Susan Lewis (18:36):
Yeah. Thank you. Yeah.
Fanshen Cox (18:39):
Your new job. What's a day in your life like now?
Susan Lewis (18:45):
Zoom 10:00 to 6:00.
Fanshen Cox (18:47):
Wow.
Susan Lewis (18:48):
I can't. I can't make phone calls. Any time I'm not on a Zoom, we have a window between a Zoom, I'm on the phone with my assistant and we're trying to get through some phone calls because it's important to respond to the people that are incoming, and have questions about their clients that we're working with, or a pitch that we heard. 10:00 to 6:00 it's staff meetings. We have multiple staff meetings.
Fanshen Cox (18:48):
With all of the projects that are happening right now?
Susan Lewis (19:22):
With the staff. We have senior staff meetings.
Fanshen Cox (19:22):
Okay.
Susan Lewis (19:27):
And we're talking about what's happening during that week.
Fanshen Cox (19:30):
Okay.
Susan Lewis (19:30):
What the pitches are, what things are being bought, where we're selling things. Strategy. We're talking with our production department; we're talking with business affairs. "Where are we with this deal? Where are we with that deal?"
Fanshen Cox (19:48):
It's a lot.
Susan Lewis (19:49):
And then I do one with our drama department where I just kind of get us all on the same page, and make sure that I have a good overview of what they're working on, any obstacles that they might need ... to help them overcome or -
Anya Adams (20:02):
What might be an obstacle that one of your people have that you're helping with? Can you ...
Susan Lewis (20:07):
Could be anything. Could be working with a producer who's challenging.
Fanshen Cox (20:18):
COVID. COVID. I'm imagining that's a challenge right now.
Susan Lewis (20:20):
There's a whole ... Our production department is, that's their responsibility, right?
Fanshen Cox (20:20):
Yeah.
Susan Lewis (20:25):
Making sure that we're staying on budget, that people have all the protocols. That's what they are consumed with. Yeah. And these COVID budgets, which have inflated the cost of shows. It's a whole new way of doing business. It's a whole new way of making shows. Luckily everybody's been safe on our shows, so that's good.
Fanshen Cox (20:49):
Great. Great.
Susan Lewis (20:49):
But there's a backlog of projects, though, because we've only recently been able to go back into production.
Fanshen Cox (20:57):
Right.
Susan Lewis (20:58):
So now there's all these shows that haven't been made, and because the only thing that people could do during this time was write, we have more material than ...
Fanshen Cox (21:07):
Right.
Susan Lewis (21:08):
Which is part of what is making everybody crazy, because there's just so much material and people are stockpiling IP.
Fanshen Cox (21:17):
Yeah.
Susan Lewis (21:17):
Because it's the only thing people can do. Listen to podcasts, read books, watch a foreign movie that you then want to turn into a series. It is bananas! The IP market has exploded, and then we had, in the midst, a social justice ... we had an uprising. Which completely changed things again.
Fanshen Cox (21:40):
Yeah. The industry responded.
Susan Lewis (21:43):
They definitely responded.
Fanshen Cox (21:44):
And people like you, because they're scrambling for the few black women, brown women, indigenous women who have experience in the industry, right? So they're like, "We got to get this person right now!"
Susan Lewis (22:00):
Yes.
Fanshen Cox (22:00):
They've been grabbed into other projects.
Susan Lewis (22:03):
Yes. Yes.
Anya Adams (22:03):
Are you taking projects now and rewriting or reimagining, because that's what happened on the show "Social Distance" that I was on. "Social Distancing." We started shooting. George Floyd was murdered, and then they took the whole entire project and interwove the riots.
Susan Lewis (22:19):
Right. I would say it's more moving forward, what type of content are we considering? And there's been an institutionalized focus at ABC, one of the networks that we sell to, about inclusion standards and having to hit those standards in order to get a show on their air.
Anya Adams (22:42):
Wow!
Fanshen Cox (22:42):
Oh my goodness!
Anya Adams (22:42):
That's amazing.
Fanshen Cox (22:46):
Yes! That's great.
Susan Lewis (22:47):
So that's one of the things that changed. That show better be inclusive. And it's not just the cast.
Fanshen Cox (22:56):
Great. Great.
Susan Lewis (22:56):
Which we all know, right? It's not just the people on the screen, it's the people behind the screen. It's the directors; it's the writers; it's the producers; it's all of those key people, key hires and key creative elements.
Anya Adams (23:12):
Hey, this is Sister Brunch. I'm Anya Adams. We'll be right back after this quick musical break.
And we are back to our conversation with senior VP and head of drama development for ABC Signature, Susan Lewis.
Fanshen Cox (23:38):
Now that dirt, in the best of ways, the push is to reach certain targets. Where are you finding the talent, and are you coming up against people saying, "We don't know where to find the talent."
Susan Lewis (23:52):
No.
Fanshen Cox (23:52):
Right.
Susan Lewis (23:55):
Don't tell me that. Don't say that to me.
Fanshen Cox (23:55):
Good. Good.
Susan Lewis (23:59):
You can't say that to me because I'm like, "I have lists. I have a lot of lists."
Fanshen Cox (24:02):
Good. Good. Yes.
Susan Lewis (24:06):
And I have a lot of people out there in the industry that I can call.
Fanshen Cox (24:10):
All the people that you've made relationships with.
Susan Lewis (24:10):
The managers and -
Fanshen Cox (24:13):
You develop relationships in the industry through working with people and you get to a point where there's literally not anything someone can say they need to hire and you don't know somebody to be able to point to. Yeah. It's just such a bullshit response. Not only do we ... And it's not even a list of people we don't know. It's a list of people we know and will vouch for, right? Yeah. Yeah.
Susan Lewis (24:41):
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Yes. Yes. And, if we don't know, we can get through to that person through this list. I happen to come into a studio at a time when, after George Floyd, the [bipocked 00:24:53] coalition at Signature formed and they sent a letter to senior management.
Fanshen Cox (24:58):
Yes!
Susan Lewis (24:58):
And they instituted bi-weekly Zooms.
Fanshen Cox (25:02):
Yes.
Susan Lewis (25:05):
Here's the beauty. Money talks. This is a business.
Fanshen Cox (25:09):
Yes.
Susan Lewis (25:11):
And what people are, I think, coming aware of is demographics are on our side.
Fanshen Cox (25:16):
Yes.
Susan Lewis (25:16):
Right? California's already a majority minority state. They know the population is changing.
Fanshen Cox (25:24):
Yep.
Susan Lewis (25:24):
And if you want to keep those people watching TV or subscribing to your network, they have to see themselves.
Fanshen Cox (25:31):
They need to see themselves. And then the money will flow in!
Susan Lewis (25:33):
And the money will continue flowing in, or maybe more.
Fanshen Cox (25:36):
As was your point with "Twilight".
Susan Lewis (25:37):
That's right.
Fanshen Cox (25:37):
That's the thing is that I think that we are turning to the place where their need to maintain racism and sexism, they're realizing that it's not profitable. They should've realized it before, but it was so important to them to maintain it that they were willing to let the dollars go. Now they're like, "Okay, fine." I don't know which position is better in some ways because I'm kind of like, "Now they're literally like, 'I'm still going to be racist and sexist, but I'm also going to make money off of you all.'"
Susan Lewis (26:11):
Look at Rupert Murdoch.
Fanshen Cox (26:12):
Yeah. Yep.
Susan Lewis (26:13):
Rupert Murdoch has made money off of black people.
Fanshen Cox (26:13):
Yep.
Susan Lewis (26:19):
For decades. The Fox network was started and all the shows were black people.
Fanshen Cox (26:26):
Yeah.
Susan Lewis (26:27):
And then that wasn't working, and suddenly that wasn't what you'd see on the network, but, hello, "Empire."
Fanshen Cox (26:33):
Yep.
Susan Lewis (26:35):
That's his network, and that's the big show. Because I don't think ... He just wants the money.
Fanshen Cox (26:42):
What the good news is, is that hopefully, and of course now we have examples of Lil Wayne and other folks who can question this theory, but hopefully the more we rise, we're then in the positions of power to do the hiring, right? So that we can say, "Fine, you can make this money off of me right now because a LeBron James can create 'Spring Hill', can create 'Untitled', and then more and more the content will be ours and we'll profit from it." And it takes us back full-circle to why it's so exciting that you do what you do! It matters, Susan Lewis, that you are in the position that you're in. You are now part of history because you will influence what young little Susan Lewises need to have in her life and didn't get to have in her life, and you're now making that. It's freaking amazing.
Susan Lewis (27:40):
Well, thank you.
Fanshen Cox (27:42):
Yeah. Thank you.
Anya Adams (27:42):
Before we go, do you want to shout out any mentors or collaborators that really were a highlight for you along the way?
Susan Lewis (27:49):
Well I have a north star, Stephanie Elaine, who I just always look to. In my own way, it's like "what would Stephanie do?" Look, she produced the Oscars.
Fanshen Cox (28:04):
As she mentioned. Her first big one was "Boyz n the Hood" right?
Susan Lewis (28:08):
Yeah. Cut to, I remember being at a breakfast with her a few years ago, when I was still working with Alicia, and they were starting up the writers' room on "Dear White People".
Fanshen Cox (28:21):
Yes.
Susan Lewis (28:22):
And she was like, "Susan, you have to get into TV. It's such a great space."
Fanshen Cox (28:28):
Right.
Susan Lewis (28:28):
And I was like, "Hmm, okay, if Stephanie says that."
Fanshen Cox (28:31):
How can we, when we know that someone's in your position, how do we support you as ... social media influencers, or what can we do?
Susan Lewis (28:43):
This is an ongoing conversation.
Fanshen Cox (28:43):
Yes.
Susan Lewis (28:47):
This conversation that we're having isn't stopping, and that's good.
Anya Adams (28:51):
I do want to say, I feel like, as workers in the industry, folks that are listening support you, but for those of us in the industry, we need to continue to develop young talent in all the different departments of diverse persuasions so that Susan can lift them up.
Fanshen Cox (29:08):
Yes.
Anya Adams (29:08):
There's a seismic shift of the culture in Hollywood to want to diversify, and they go to their one black friend and ask them, "Give me everyone," instead of knowing people [inaudible 00:29:20].
Susan Lewis (29:20):
And making sure people know that there are other jobs besides development. There's production design. There's being an editor. There's being a line producer. That's an incredibly influential position to have, and uses the creative side of your brain as well as the other parts of it. And we need to be in those spaces, too.
Fanshen Cox (29:41):
Awesome. Susan Lewis, it's been so great to have you on.
Susan Lewis (29:46):
Thank you.
Fanshen Cox (29:47):
Love hearing your story. Again, we have to point out that there has not been one guest we've had that had immediate ties to someone in the industry. All of our guests are people who just knew that they wanted to tell stories, knew that they wanted to do something creative and ended up in these amazing positions to be able to do it, and to be able to hire others to come along with them. So it's just awesome. Thank you, Susan Lewis.
Susan Lewis (29:47):
Thank you.
Fanshen Cox (30:23):
That was our conversation with Susan Lewis. Go to sisterbrunch.com to learn more about her work and where to follow her on social. And thank you so very much for listening to Sister Brunch with Anya Adams and me, Fanshen Cox. You can follow us on Instagram at Sister Brunch Podcast and Twitter at SisterBrunch to catch up with us, find out what we're watching, support all of our amazing black women plus guests. We're also on Facebook at Facebook.com/sisterbrunchpodcast. Hey, please, don't forget to subscribe and rate and review our show wherever you get your podcasts.
Our show producer is Britney Turner. Our executive producer is Christabel Nsiah Buadi]. We acknowledge that the land we record our podcast on is the original land of the Tongva people for those of us in Los Angeles, and the Coast Salish for Anya in Vancouver. Tune in next time.
