Rae Benjamin: Demystifying the Entertainment Industry
Episode Description:
Rae Benjamin is a staff writer on season 3 of THE WITCHER (Netflix). She is the co-creator of the animated web series, JULISA WHO? , currently in development with Topic Studios and available to watch on Instagram and YouTube. Rae is also the founder of In the Cut, an organization that shares vital industry information and creates inclusive spaces for BIPOC creators. Since 2020, the In the Cut community has grown to more than 8,000+ artists and filmmakers across the globe. In the episode, Rae speaks to Fanshen about her career transition from graphic designer to screenwriter and why it was important for her to create In the Cut.
Transcript:
Fanshen Cox (00:12):
Hey, welcome back to Sista Brunch with me, Fanshen Cox. And my beautiful co-host is very busy right now directing lots of different things all in a row, so she will be back with us very soon, but meantime, I am here alone with today's guest. And I cannot wait for you to know more about her. If this might be your first time listening to the podcast, this is a podcast about black women and non-binary folks striving and thriving in media entertainment and the arts. And we cannot wait to share more stories with you over the next few weeks.
Fanshen Cox (00:46):
Now, today's guest is Rae Benjamin. She is a staff writer on season three of The Witcher on Netflix and is also writing an animated feature for Netflix. She's the co-creator of the animated web series, Julisa, Who? And that is currently in development with Topic Studios and available to watch on Instagram and YouTube. Ooh, we'll be talking about that exactly how folks can see it. Rae is also the founder of In The Cut. If you are not getting their newsletter, what are you doing with your life? Make sure you sign up for their newsletter and we'll talk about that too. She's the founder of In The Cut. It's an organization that shares vital industry information and creates inclusive spaces for BIPOC creators. Since 2020, the In The Cut community has grown to more than 8,000 plus artists and filmmakers across the globe. So glad to have you on, Rae.
Rae Benjamin (01:40):
Thank you. I'm glad to be here.
Fanshen Cox (01:42):
Yes.
Rae Benjamin (01:42):
I sound very illustrious with the intro. Thanks for the-
Fanshen Cox (01:46):
You're very illustrious. 8,000 is nothing to laugh at. Plus obviously, the fact that you're actually working. So we'll get into how one balances all of this, all of the good things that you do for community as well as your regular job. But we always like to start our show by asking our guests to kind of go back as far as you'd like to from the beginning and talk about what has your path been to this career that you're on now?
Rae Benjamin (02:13):
Yeah. I think my path was very nontraditional, very haphazard, if you will. I'm someone that did not go to film school. I had a completely different career and switched careers. So I actually was a graphic designer for a number of years. And I quit my graphic design job in 2018 and decided... I'd always done writing. It wasn't like a completely new... I'd written all my life. I went to an arts high school for creative writing, but I just never took it seriously, I guess, as a career. But in 2018, I decided I'm going to do what I want to do. So I quit working full time and just did freelance design so that I could have time to write. And luckily, I quit my job in the summer, and luckily by October, I got my first job in the industry, which was being writer's assistant on Bridgerton season one. So I-
Fanshen Cox (03:20):
Wow. Just a little something called Bridgerton in case anyone has heard of that show. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. You can't skip from, "Then I just left my job and started as a writer's assistant on Bridgerton." Tell us how you did that.
Rae Benjamin (03:36):
Yeah. Basically everything is about networking. Like, this industry is completely word-of-mouth, whether that's good or bad, but it is sort of... Unfortunately like jobs especially in a writer's room are not really publicly posted in any capacity. So you just sort of have to find out. So I'll rewind little bit more.
Fanshen Cox (04:00):
Okay.
Rae Benjamin (04:00):
So January of 2018, I had made a vow. Like, I'm going to have a job in the entertainment industry by the end of the year even though I don't really know anything about this and don't know anyone who does this, but I'll figure it out. So then I started to do more research and figure things out. And I was able to get involved with the Hillman Grad Mentoring from Lena Waithe. But back when I joined it, wasn't like it is now. Like, it wasn't a formalized sort of thing. You could literally just DM Lena and you would be in it. So that's how I got in.
Fanshen Cox (04:41):
But how did you get Lena's.... You mean like on her social-
Rae Benjamin (04:44):
[crosstalk 00:04:44] Instagram, like literally, it was not... It was like...
Fanshen Cox (04:47):
I love that.
Rae Benjamin (04:49):
But that was before Lena had won her Emmy. So I feel like she wasn't as famous and inundated as she was back then, so it really was just easier.
Fanshen Cox (05:02):
No, I love this point because I have made this point to people before and I've done it before. A writer we were working with on developing a series did the same thing. He found a writer he really loved and just DM'd him and was like, "Would you be willing to even just read the script or talk to us?" And I think this is such a good point that a lot of times people don't realize that we want to help you. You know? And social is a way for you to kind of reach out. I think that's such a good example. And so, all to say, if you can't do it with Lena anymore because obviously she's blown up, but find the next Lena. Right? Like, there are all kinds of especially black women coming up who are... You know? They're written up in the emerging storytellers or whatever. Find those women or the Rae Benjamins. I don't want to blow up your Dms too much.
Rae Benjamin (05:54):
Yeah. No. Don't DM me. You can DM In The Cut though.
Fanshen Cox (05:57):
There you go. There you go.
Rae Benjamin (05:58):
I do answer all those DMs, but DM my personal-
Fanshen Cox (06:03):
So in other words, you got to find the upcoming Rae Benjamin, like who's-
Rae Benjamin (06:07):
Literally, with In The Cut, I strive to make myself available.
Fanshen Cox (06:11):
I love it.
Rae Benjamin (06:12):
So any question, any Dms I get, emails I get, I do answer them.
Fanshen Cox (06:18):
That's so nice.
Rae Benjamin (06:18):
I just sort of separate personal things from work things. You know?
Fanshen Cox (06:22):
Love it, love it. Okay. So you're in that program.
Rae Benjamin (06:26):
Yeah. And like I said, it wasn't like structured how it is now. So my experience is completely different than anyone who would apply and experience now. There was no application. It was just DM. And you're sort of part of like a mailing list where you would just learn of things.
Fanshen Cox (06:46):
Love it.
Rae Benjamin (06:46):
But Lena's assistant at the time, a writer named Kendra Jordan, who I really love and she's a great person, Kendra actually told me about the writer's assistant job on Bridgerton. So I had to submit a writing sample. I really didn't think I'd get the job because I primarily write comedy. And I was like, "Well, it's a drama show. I guess I should submit a drama." And I literally had only written one drama script my entire life. So I'm like, "Oh, I guess I got to send this in." And then the showrunner liked it.
Fanshen Cox (07:23):
Wow.
Rae Benjamin (07:23):
It just happened to be the one drama that I had ever written was a period piece. Bridgerton's a period piece. It was also like the same time period, though mine was set in America, but it had some similar themes. So the showrunner really like it. I went in for the interview and I got the job.
Fanshen Cox (07:42):
Wow. Okay. So certainly networking to your point, but let's not belitle the fact that you, even though this was your first script, obviously you did a good job on it. So can you talk about how you knew how to make it good?
Rae Benjamin (07:57):
Yeah. In college I took a screenwriting elective. So I had taken an elective and that's where I learned about formatting. Like I said, I'd been writing all my life. So writing was something I'd have always done since a child and had always been pretty good at. So it wasn't something I really had to learn. But screenwriting's such a different beast in terms of formatting. So really, I think taking that college course really helped me understand formatting, especially someone who I normally wrote short stories and prose. And so writing a script is sort of the opposite, I would say, of writing like a novel or prose where you're being so overly descriptive. And you might describe like the outfit the character's wearing and all their inner thoughts, but a script you sort of like get to the point. Like, if it can't be seen by the audience or heard, you're not really going into deep description.
Rae Benjamin (09:03):
So I think that was sort of challenge for me to grasp at first, but I just kept practicing. It was the first drama script I'd written, but it was not the first script I'd ever written. So I still had a pretty good grasp of writing. And I think honestly what helped me get the job beyond that was just being prepared. I knew that I was interviewing against other people. When I went in for the interview, there was several people waiting to be interviewed in the lobby. So I knew that it was a highly competitive job and I could not compete on terms of experience level because this was my first job. I had never really worked on a TV show. So I knew I couldn't compete on that, but I could compete by being prepared.
Rae Benjamin (09:52):
So the show was based on a series of books. I literally read all of those books over the weekend. Like, I read eight books in like three days so that I could know what I was talking about in the interview. I made sure I did a lot of research on the showrunner. The showrunner, Chris Van Dusen, he was a writer on Scandal, which was one of my favorite shows. So I went back and watched all the Scandal episodes that he had written so that I could compliment specific things in the interview. So I just took the preparation; what I could control was just being prepared. And so I think he was impressed by that.
Fanshen Cox (10:41):
Hey, this is Sista Brunch with Fanshen Cox. Stay tuned for more of our conversation with our incredible guest, writer, and In The Cut founder, Rae Benjamin.
Fanshen Cox (11:07):
We're back. Check out more of our conversation with Rae Benjamin.
Fanshen Cox (11:13):
So your writer's assistant on Bridgerton and then what happens?
Rae Benjamin (11:18):
So Bridgerton, we ended... I started that October, 2018. That room wrapped in like April, I think, of 2019. And then I purposely didn't want to work for a month because I had learned so much of working in the writer's room in Bridgerton. Like I said, I'm someone that didn't go to film school. I had just had taken one screenwriting class. So a lot of stuff was just practice and self-taught. So being in Bridgeton, I like to say that was like going to grad school for me. I got to see all of these writers who I admire and how they broke story and crafted character arcs and structure. And it just made me realize that I didn't really know what I was doing very well.
Rae Benjamin (12:13):
So I sort of took that month off so that I could write. And I rewrote every script that I had ever written because I just understood story at a much deeper level after working in that room. So I took a month off. And then about, I will say... Yeah. So after a month and a half maybe, I got an email from one of the writers on Bridgerton who I became close with. And she had asked if I wanted to interview for a job on The Witcher on Netflix. And I said okay. And then it was for a script coordinator job, which I also had never done. I'd only been a writer's assistant and this job was for a script coordinator. I had no experience doing that, but I sort of just said in the interview... I did prepare myself much similar to Bridgerton. Like, The Witcher is also based on books. So I made sure that... Those books are a bit longer, more denser to read than the Bridgerton books. I couldn't read all of them.
Fanshen Cox (13:21):
You couldn't... Okay. Okay.
Rae Benjamin (13:21):
But I did read one of them. So I read the first one so that I could be knowledgeable in the interview and give my thoughts. And I was just upfront. Like, "Yeah. I've never done this job before, but I am a very quick learner. And if you give me the opportunity, I will work hard and learn." And luckily, someone gave me the opportunity.
Fanshen Cox (13:48):
Love it.
Rae Benjamin (13:49):
And I will say the previous script coordinator, he had been promoted to being a staff writer. So he was still there in the room and he really helped me understand the job as well and helped me-
Fanshen Cox (14:02):
Right. Will you talk about the difference between writer's assistant and script coordinator for our listeners and for me?
Rae Benjamin (14:07):
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So there's several support staff jobs in a writer's room. The what rounds out the support staff would be the writer's PA, the writer's assistant, showrunner's assistant, and script coordinator. So as a writer's assistant, really, your job is just to take notes. You're in there with the writers every day. Obviously, writers can be in a room for a long time, maybe 8, 10, 11, 12 hours sometimes. So it's hard to remember everything that's said, so you want to make sure you're taking organized and comprehensive notes. So when the writer, it's their turn to write the episode, they can reference back to what had been said.
Rae Benjamin (14:54):
A script coordinator is a much more technical job. So your job is to review and distribute all the outlines and scripts for the show. So you also have to have a really strong grasp of script, proper script formatting, to be a script coordinator because you have to catch continuity errors a lot of the time. You have to sometimes deal with... Well, you would have to deal with the legal team as well, and sort of alert them to any sort of licensing sort of issues.
Rae Benjamin (15:33):
On The Witcher, our show, it's a fantasy show, so we didn't have that many issues. But for issues that would come up for us, example, we only have the rights to the books, not the video games. So the main issue was just checking that we're not using any of the material for the video games, like naming characters or monsters. Like, that was the main issue. But if, say, you're on a show like Abbott Elementary or something and say, "Oh, we're going to drink a can of Coke in this episode," then you would have to alert the legal team and get permission from Coke, that sort of thing. So script coordinator is more of a technical job. But usually, you still also have the opportunity to be in the writer's room and observe and pitch ideas. Unless there's a script going out, then you need to go and proof read it and send it out.
Fanshen Cox (16:27):
Love it. Okay. So where does that take us to in your career path? So you're still at The Witcher obviously.
Rae Benjamin (16:35):
Yeah. So the room ended, but script coordinator, you're still staying on the show through production because scripts are being rewritten and re-released. So as script coordinator, you have a much longer job than if you're just a writer's assistant because you're only there while the show shows being written. So stayed on show during production, but then COVID happened. So our show got shut down for several months. And I was actually blessed, to be honest, because Netflix was great and paid us all even though we couldn't do our job.
Fanshen Cox (17:12):
That's great. That is good to know.
Rae Benjamin (17:12):
So I'll always shout out to Netflix for doing that.
Fanshen Cox (17:17):
They do good things. They do good things too.
Rae Benjamin (17:19):
Because I know a lot of people that worked at other studios and they just lost their jobs.
Fanshen Cox (17:24):
They have nothing. Yeah. Yeah.
Rae Benjamin (17:26):
So I actually used that time. I had several months off and luckily I was getting paid, so I wasn't stressed.
Fanshen Cox (17:33):
Yes.
Rae Benjamin (17:33):
So I used that time to write and I wrote a new pilot that I had been thinking about. And that pilot helped me get representation. A few, a couple of the writers on The Witcher asked to read my work and they both liked it. So they sent along to various reps. And then I got another meeting at a different company because of my web series.
Fanshen Cox (17:59):
I just want to check in. Are you aware of the definition of rest? Because I'm like... Okay. Both times now that you've mentioned you've had some time off, you wrote, which... Listen. We want to encourage our listeners to be a badass like Rae. But also, Rae, I'm going to be a little Aunty Fanshen here and just make sure you do get some where to rest.
Rae Benjamin (18:24):
Yeah. I'm very chill. I'm very-
Fanshen Cox (18:28):
Good.
Rae Benjamin (18:28):
... Not stressed. I don't know.
Fanshen Cox (18:29):
Okay. Okay.
Rae Benjamin (18:30):
I just also like being productive. And I don't necessarily always count being productive as doing something for consumption. Like, for me, going on a hike is a productive day for me.
Fanshen Cox (18:45):
Oh. So you'll be joining us on the 11 mile run?
Rae Benjamin (18:48):
Hey. Look. I hiked 12 miles a couple months ago.
Fanshen Cox (18:51):
I love it. It doesn't scare you away. I'll be sending you the details after this.
Rae Benjamin (18:56):
But I don't know. For me, I just like to be doing stuff.
Fanshen Cox (19:01):
Yes. Okay.
Rae Benjamin (19:01):
I don't like to be idle very long.
Fanshen Cox (19:06):
Understood. Understood. Yes.
Rae Benjamin (19:07):
So-
Fanshen Cox (19:08):
But, okay. So this is why you were filling your time. And I mean, it is clear that you like writing. You know what I'm saying?
Rae Benjamin (19:15):
Yeah.
Fanshen Cox (19:15):
Like, that is also something that fulfills you beyond just work and I think you can really see that. And I think if we shift into talking about In The Cut, I feel that through your posts, I feel that you love writing, you love being a writer, and you also love the writing community. And I really like... That comes so clear. It comes really beautifully and clearly. So at what point during all of this did you create In The Cut?
Rae Benjamin (19:48):
Yeah, I started In The Cut like right before the pandemic. So I was still a script coordinator on The Witcher. We picked back up production. Oh yeah. We were still in production because the pandemic hadn't started. But I had always sort of had this idea ever since I became a writer's assistant because I found it was very hard to find information about how to become a television writer. I didn't even know what a writer's assistant was.
Fanshen Cox (20:17):
Right.
Rae Benjamin (20:18):
I didn't know what a script coordinator was. I mean, I eventually knew because I had those jobs, but a lot of times I think information is just very difficult to come by. And I'm someone that grew up in LA. I'm from here. And if I didn't know these things and found it difficult to find information, I'm sure other people were having the same issues.
Rae Benjamin (20:43):
So I actually started In The Cut as sort of a live event. We did our first event January, 2020. And it was just sort of like a workshop. It included me and several of my other friends who were either staff writers or assistants. And we were just giving people information. It wasn't like a panel. It was like a workshop where we were each sitting in small groups with the audience and we each just rotate groups so people could actually get their questions answered and also create a sense of community with one another. And it went well. We sold out in like an hour. And I just put it on Instagram. Like, I did no sort of promos. So it shocked me.
Rae Benjamin (21:31):
And so I was ready to do the next event and then Corona happened and I had to cancel that event in March. But that also was sort of a good way for me to shift because at first I was just like, "Well, I started this business and now I can't do it because of the pandemic." But a friend suggested that I do a webinar instead. And at first, I just made a free webinar to just replace the event that I was supposed to do, but it went so well that I thought, "Oh, I guess I can just shift into doing this sort of thing now." And so now out everything's pretty much online. I do webinars at least once a month. I've started to do actually also longer format courses that are much smaller, like 15 people max, where you can learn for a month. I do want to start doing live events again, but it-
Fanshen Cox (22:29):
We're getting closer. I feel like we're getting closer to that. Maybe this summer. Tell our listeners a little bit more generally about In The Cut. So first of all, where can they find you, and then what resources can they access, and how do they become members, et cetera.
Rae Benjamin (22:46):
Yeah. So you can go to our website, which is inthecutla.org. And on there, there's information. We have a resources page that's just a list of books, podcasts, even YouTube videos, networking events, or networking groups and blogs that we recommend for people who are interested in being primarily writers. But we also have information for actors, directors, producers, et cetera. And that's just our resources page.
Rae Benjamin (23:18):
You can also follow us on Instagram @inthecutla and we share information on there as well. And then we have our Mighty Network, which is sort of like, I call it like a private Facebook pretty much, but it functions in the same way. And you can join that for free to network with other screenwriters and filmmakers and meet and create with each other. And also you can upgrade to our premium version and then you'll get free access to all the webinars that we do, plus you'll get access to all the recordings of all the past webinars we've done. We've done almost 30 at this point. And we have great, great people. We've had Deniese Davis who was Emmy nominated producer of Insecure, Black Lady Sketch Show. We've had just a lot of people.
Fanshen Cox (24:18):
I love it. And Rae Benjamin, who now is too late for you to DM her personally, but you can, and we will reiterate, to DM on In The Cut.
Rae Benjamin (24:27):
Yes, yes.
Fanshen Cox (24:29):
On Instagram. So this is amazing. And I think it's all such a great resource. And yet the reason we have to do this is because a lot of times still we're the only ones in the room. So I wonder if you're open to talking about what that experience has been. Was it different on Bridgerton as much as you can talk about it on Bridgeton versus The Witcher? What has it been like to be a black woman in these rooms?
Rae Benjamin (24:56):
Yeah. I think it's... I feel like it's hard to compare just because my roles are different as an assistant versus being a writer. There's just different expectations. But I will say I've been fortunate to only have worked on shows where my opinion was valued. Like, there's been a couple instances, one instance I can say, but even that was not from the showrunner. That was from just another person who sucked. But-
Fanshen Cox (25:38):
There's always one.
Rae Benjamin (25:39):
Yes.
Fanshen Cox (25:39):
But wonderful that it was just one.
Rae Benjamin (25:41):
Yeah.
Fanshen Cox (25:41):
That you had a one specific incident. Okay.
Rae Benjamin (25:44):
Yeah, honestly.
Fanshen Cox (25:45):
That's great.
Rae Benjamin (25:45):
And I think I'm very intentional about that though. Like, me, I was just raised to believe that my peace of mind is more important to anything. Like, my mom literally would go just quit a job. If people made her mad, she would just quit and didn't care and she'd get another job. Like, I know I'm skilled. I know what I'm talking about. I don't need to be in scarcity mode thinking that I need to be clinging to one opportunity. So that's really my mentality. I'm very intentional about where I work. And if it's not a fit, I'll just quit. And it's not that bad. I don't really care that much. Like, I don't...
Fanshen Cox (26:32):
I need you in my life, sister. I need to... Yeah. Can I just pick up the phone sometimes where you should just remind me that it's not that serious? I say this a lot. Like, the world is wide. Right? And especially now, in the best of ways, there are so many opportunities in the industry because there are so many platforms and so many different things you can write for, or direct for, or produce for. So this isn't the end of the world if something isn't right for you. It's okay for you to move on.
Fanshen Cox (27:02):
Hey, it's Fanshen and you're listening to Sista Brunch. We will be right back. But if you have not done this already, please go ahead and follow us on Twitter @SistaBrunch, Instagram @sistabrunchpodcast, and Facebook at facebook.com/sistabrunchpodcast. Leave us a comment, slide in a DM, share your news with us. We really want to celebrate your hard work. So go ahead and find us on all the socials.
Fanshen Cox (27:29):
So Rae Benjamin, how can we, Sista Brunch, and also our listeners find you, support you? Obviously we know about In The Cut, but how about you personally? How can we support you?
Rae Benjamin (27:40):
Me personally, I feel like... I don't know. I'd rather people support In The Cut.
Fanshen Cox (27:46):
You are so good.
Rae Benjamin (27:46):
I'm just-
Fanshen Cox (27:46):
She's so good. I didn't set her up for that, but you just good. You just a good person, right?
Rae Benjamin (27:56):
Yeah. I don't... I just launched last week a new initiative called a Show Support Initiative for In The Cut.
Fanshen Cox (28:03):
Oh my goodness.
Rae Benjamin (28:03):
So I created a series of training videos that teach people about the entry level support staff jobs in the writer's room. So we cover writer's PA, writer's assistant, and showrunner's assistant. And this is a free course that people can watch. And after they watch it, they can create a profile on our database, which is made available to employers. There's people that have already gotten hired from this. And it's only been out for a week. So I ask you that if you're interested in these jobs that you sign up and take the course. And you can find that out at our website inthecutla.org, or if you're in a position to hire people that you access the database and use it. Like, my whole impetus for creating this is because once I started to become an assistant, and then further when I started In The Cut, a lot of people would ask me to recommend BIPOC assistance, but they always wanted people with experience. And I'm like, "You can't say that you're committed to diversity, but also refuse to train people at the same time."
Fanshen Cox (29:16):
Say that. Right.
Rae Benjamin (29:17):
It doesn't make any sense.
Fanshen Cox (29:18):
Yeah.
Rae Benjamin (29:19):
And so I understand maybe there's hesitance to train people because the industry's very fast paced. You just want someone that knows what you're doing. But at the same time, I feel like these jobs are not rocket science. They just... Anyone can do them, I believe, if you just have some information. So I wanted to see how I could help sort of even the playing field and give new people opportunities.
Fanshen Cox (29:44):
I love it. Now, since you didn't say something that we could do for you, because you are like that, you're such a good person as to what people can do for the community, but I will say how about some views on Julisa, Who?
Rae Benjamin (29:56):
Oh okay. Yeah. Yeah.
Fanshen Cox (29:56):
Would that be helpful? See? You know? Okay. So we can see Julisa, Who? who on YouTube and Instagram and it can't hurt to... Y'all just go watch it a few times, share the link. Tell folks to give some love to that web series.
Rae Benjamin (30:11):
Yes, you can do that.
Fanshen Cox (30:14):
We thank you. Rae, this has been incredible. I mean, as I said, I had already been following your work, but getting to know you a little bit here is just, I'm so glad and honored to know you and to know about the work that you continue to do. And also, as I said, Sista Brunch, and all of our listeners, we are very much here to support you and your work. So thank you so much for spending time with us.
Rae Benjamin (30:38):
Thank you for having me. I had a great time.
Fanshen Cox (30:48):
All right, everybody. That was our conversation with Rae Benjamin. Visit sistabrunch.com to find out more about Rae and also how to support all of her upcoming projects. And don't forget to give her some views on web series, Julisa, Who?. Follow us on Instagram @sistabrunchpodcast. We're also on twitter @sisterbrunch, and on Facebook at facebook.com/sistabrunchpodcast. If you got questions for our ask Sista Brunch segment, well visit sistabrunch.com to fill out the question form and we might just read and answer your question on the air.
Fanshen Cox (31:24):
Also, don't forget to sign up for our monthly newsletter to get job tips, viewing recommendations, and lots more. And don't forget to subscribe, rate, and review our show on iTunes. Your support is so helpful and so important to us. Our senior producer is Sonata Lee Narcisse. Our show producer is Brittany Turner. Our executive producer is Christabel Nsiah-Buadi. We acknowledge that the land we record our podcast on is the original land of the Tongva people for those of us in Los Angeles. Can't wait to see you next time and take care, everybody.